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"An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics - Moderator: Moderators
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
In the interest of education I would just like to point out that Japanese and Chinese kanji (lettering) are extremely complex and difficult to translate. It is not as straight this symbol means this, and that symbol means that.

Context is extremely important as whole sentences can have different meanings with the change of the subject of the discussion.

For that reason at the very least one should be extremely careful in choosing kanji if one desires to place them permanently on their skin, but also in jumping to conclusions based of a written language one knows nothing about.

I believe that with the proper context the Kanjii in question can also mean something along the lines of King of Kings, or the largest King.

Luckily a friend of mine works for the government teaching Chinese to future translators in the military/intelligence fields. So if I can speak with him sometime soon I can give a list of all the possible meanings if anyone wants.

I would like to add that I know very little of his "ministry" so will withhold judgment for the time being. I neither support or resist his teachings.

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Wed May 14, 2008 4:52 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
Well it dont' take a rocket scientist to see the truth concerning Todd Bentley Shadowsbane...you either discern what is going on by the Spirit of God and read the distortions upon distortions of teachings Todd Bentley has put on the internet or you lean to your own understanding and get duped by the enemey...just that simple and plain...

As far as the kanji tattoo writing interpretation...ask your friend...it will be interesting to find out what they say...But I don't need an interpretation of the writing to know that tattoos are not something directed by the HS to ones body...its one thing to come to the Lord and have tattoos already on your body from living in the world...it is quite another to do it while you are supposively "serving Christ"...all it takes is one to know the word of God and the Person who is the Author of the word of God to see the truth...
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Wed May 14, 2008 5:07 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
Well I truthfully I haven't heard word one about him, ever until today. Period. So excuse me for not jumping on the bandwagon. But since the link in the OP seems to imply that the entire written language of China and Japan (well only half of Japanese to be fair) is really just spells and demonic, I feel the need to find another source of information when they are telling me to beware, and what I should beware of.

I will acquiesce that it is possible that I am reading too much into that, but it is something I have had to deal with many times before so I am a bit sensitive to it.

As for the tattoos that is perhaps a discussion for another thread, at another time.

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Wed May 14, 2008 5:14 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
yes it is quite common of people to be VERY cautious when it comes to believing that satan and demons are behind alot of deceiving teachings, belief systems that oppose God's word, false religions, etc.. I don't understand why...its almost like people don't even believe satan can have that much influence to deceive...because the word says that he in fact deceives the nations... [whistle]

But if you do some searches on your own on the web you will see plenty of information...Just look at Todd Bentley's teachings on this other thread http://forum.NarrowIsTheWay.org/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1051

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Wed May 14, 2008 5:22 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
Yes the Spanish Inquisition and the Salem Witch Trials come to mind. One man's caution is another man's persecution.

How much evil has been committed by "good" people in the name of the Lord?

Deception is a two edged sword. Some are indeed led astray by demons. However, mankind if anything is quite resourceful in creating their own sin, and their own cages. Most simply by being too trusting of those who appear to "agree" with them.

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Wed May 14, 2008 5:43 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
shadowsbane wrote:
How much evil has been committed by "good" people in the name of the Lord?


And how do you suppose that is? Was it because men did it all on their own without any help from satan?

2 Cor 11:13 For such men are false apostles, deceitful workers, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ.
2 Cor 11:14 No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.
2 Cor 11:15 Therefore it is not surprising if his servants also disguise themselves as servants of righteousness, whose end will be according to their deeds.

From in the beginning in Genesis I seem to recall that it wasn't man that came up with their own resouces to sin against God...But it was satan that came to them to tempt them by perverting what is true along with some doubt...Eve didn't sin on her own nor did she come up with the original idea to turn away from God but it was the serpent who beguiled Eve through temptation..

And Jesus was in the wilderness to be "tempted of the devil"...

1 John 3:8 the one who practices sin is of the devil; for the devil has sinned from the beginning. The Son of God appeared for this purpose, to destroy the works of the devil.

James 1:13 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone.
James 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust.
James 1:15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
James 1:16 Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren.

John 8:43 "Why do you not understand what I am saying? {It is} because you cannot hear My word.
John 8:44 "You are of {your} father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own {nature,} for he is a liar and the father of lies.

Acts 26:18 to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.'Matt 16:23 But He turned and said to Peter, "Get behind Me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to Me; for you are not setting your mind on God's interests, but man's."

Luke 22:3 And Satan entered into Judas who was called Iscariot, belonging to the number of the twelve.

1 Cor 7:5 Stop depriving one another, except by agreement for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer, and come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

Acts 5:3 But Peter said, "Ananias, why has Satan filled your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit and to keep back {some} of the price of the land?

1 Cor 10:21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; you cannot partake of the table of the Lord and the table of demons.

2 Cor 2:11 so that no advantage would be taken of us by Satan, for we are not ignorant of his schemes.

1 Thess 2:18 For we wanted to come to you--I, Paul, more than once--and {yet} Satan hindered us.

1 Tim 4:1 But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will fall away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons,

1 Tim 5:15 for some have already turned aside to follow Satan.

Rev 2:9 ¶ 'I know your tribulation and your poverty (but you are rich), and the blasphemy by those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Rev 2:13 'I know where you dwell, where Satan's throne is; and you hold fast My name, and did not deny My faith even in the days of Antipas, My witness, My faithful one, who was killed among you, where Satan dwells.

Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

Rev 9:20 The rest of mankind, who were not killed by these plagues, did not repent of the works of their hands, so as not to worship demons, and the idols of gold and of silver and of brass and of stone and of wood, which can neither see nor hear nor walk;

Rev 16:14 for they are spirits of demons, performing signs, which go out to the kings of the whole world, to gather them together for the war of the great day of God, the Almighty.

Rev 18:2 And he cried out with a mighty voice, saying, "Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great! She has become a dwelling place of demons and a prison of every unclean spirit, and a prison of every unclean and hateful bird.

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Wed May 14, 2008 6:24 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
Candy, Shadowsbane has made clear that he knows nothing of Todd. How can we possibly imply that a person that knows nothing of someone is not discerning, when they know nothing of them?

That's like me saying that I don't know if George Fox (a randomly picked name) is of God or not, and someone claiming that I'm not discerning because of that.

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Wed May 14, 2008 6:27 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
Trent wrote:
Candy, Shadowsbane has made clear that he knows nothing of Todd. How can we possibly imply that a person that knows nothing of someone is not discerning, when they know nothing of them?

That's like me saying that I don't know if George Fox (a randomly picked name) is of God or not, and someone claiming that I'm not discerning because of that.


Trent you are reading things into what I have said...I wasn't implying that Shadowsbane personally was undiscerning...I read what he said that he had no knowledge of Todd Bentley...

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Wed May 14, 2008 6:30 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
purge-out-theleaven wrote:
Trent wrote:
Candy, Shadowsbane has made clear that he knows nothing of Todd. How can we possibly imply that a person that knows nothing of someone is not discerning, when they know nothing of them?

That's like me saying that I don't know if George Fox (a randomly picked name) is of God or not, and someone claiming that I'm not discerning because of that.


Trent you are reading things into what I have said...I wasn't implying that Shadowsbane personally was undiscerning...I read what he said that he had no knowledge of Todd Bentley...


He didn't post about the subject without knowledge. He spoke only on kanji.

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Wed May 14, 2008 6:32 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
Trent wrote:
He didn't post about the subject without knowledge. He spoke only on kanji.


Yup I can read too [thumbup]

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Wed May 14, 2008 6:38 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
shadowsbane wrote:
In the interest of education I would just like to point out that Japanese and Chinese kanji (lettering) are extremely complex and difficult to translate. It is not as straight this symbol means this, and that symbol means that.

Context is extremely important as whole sentences can have different meanings with the change of the subject of the discussion.

For that reason at the very least one should be extremely careful in choosing kanji if one desires to place them permanently on their skin, but also in jumping to conclusions based of a written language one knows nothing about.

I believe that with the proper context the Kanjii in question can also mean something along the lines of King of Kings, or the largest King.

Luckily a friend of mine works for the government teaching Chinese to future translators in the military/intelligence fields. So if I can speak with him sometime soon I can give a list of all the possible meanings if anyone wants.

I would like to add that I know very little of his "ministry" so will withhold judgment for the time being. I neither support or resist his teachings.



I would be very interested in other possible meanings for this. I just looked up the characters in a kanji dictionary and i knew that it could mean something else together, but i couldn't figure out how to look up a phrase, only individual characters.


Wed May 14, 2008 8:49 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
But didn't someone who knows kanji call Pat Holliday, and say that it meant "emma-o", the guardian of hell?

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Wed May 14, 2008 8:58 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
This is what Pat's newsletter said

" Yvette writes: “But when I went into the site the characters changed but this looks very close to the tattoo on Todd arms. It is a tattoo about Emma-o ~ Emma Dai-o- Enma God. I’m not exactly sure of the meaning the way it is written on his arm but this is the tattoo. "


Wed May 14, 2008 9:27 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
It was written in one of the newsletters, "Jesus Death Mask", about the tattoos...

Quote:
HEALING SICK Yvette writes: “But when I went into the site the characters changed but this looks very close to the tattoo on Todd arms. It is a tattoo about Emma-o ~ Emma Dai-o- Enma God. I’m not exactly sure of the meaning the way it is written on his arm but this is the tattoo. ii

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Wed May 14, 2008 9:31 pm
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Post Re: "An Angel Called Emma" by Pat Holliday & Todd's tattoo pics
LOL...I was posting the same time Nichole was posting the same thing... [rotfl]

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